Sunday, November 30, 2008

Neaves Road - L2/L3

Easy ride out to Neaves Road... Mostly L2/L3 with some sprints out of the traffic lights... ending with a climb up Westwood.

For all the prep to prevent flats I still ended up with one today... I think it was a huge hunk of glass and it acted like a guilliotine to put a hole the size of a dime in the front tire, right through the tuffy liner and cut the tube... Luckily I was only a couple of blocks from the LBS and a ten minute walk got me a new tire etc... Still wasted close to an hour overall...

Saturday, November 29, 2008

BVC Friday Racing - 3rd and nothing and nothing

Elimination to 15 Lap Scratch - 3rd, then 20 Lap Tempo and Unknown distance..

I really tried in the Elimination... stayed at the front.. worked hard. Then in the scratch race portion jumped from the blue with three laps to go.. Got a good gap, I thought sufficent. 

But Deluca and Roorda managed to get over the gap and come around me in turn four in the bell lap. And just at the point they caught me my front wheel decided to exhibit a really bad case of "speed wobble".. I have no idea what causes this, but when it happens it feels like your front wheel is about to fall off.. I suspect that it is setup from hittling a "bump" on the track (our track has lot's) that sets up a sympathetic vibration at sprinting speeds (> 55).

Anyway, worst possible time, I'm being overtaken and don't know if the front wheel is about to fall off.. Well I was pretty sure it wouldn't... but still the 2-3 seconds it took to decide that was all it took for them to get over top and around me... Good chance they would have anyway, I was slowing down.

The result though was a very hard push at the end of the race.. and for some reason, possibly low humidity, my lungs felt like they would fall out... I had used my puffer, so it didn't turn into a coughing fit... but I literally didn't get my breathing back to normal for about an hour..

And the next two races where a total write off. Simply off the back in the 20 lap tempo. Did get sort of get going in the Unknown distance... but that's always a crapshoot and only managed like 6th...  

I did two fairly hard workouts earlier this week, Tuesday morning was the structured Workeout (Points race drill) and Wednesday I did some short L4/L5 intervals.. I suspect that this was a bit too much intensity and didn't help tonights performance (i.e. lack thereof...).

Anyway, it's always a matter of balance... keep CTL up, good (long term)... but if you move ATL up too much, too close to race night... not good (short term..)

Friday, November 28, 2008

BikeRadar on Aero savings

BikeRadar has a great article up on Aero Savings.

Key points from the article:
  • Position: Going from drops to aerobars will save you ~30 watts at 40km/h
  • Bike: A time trial bike will save you ~20 watts over a road bike with clip-ons at 40km/h
  • Helmet: A time trial helmet will save you ~10 watts over a road helmet at 40km/h
I'm not sure about how rigourous the tsting protocols where, they mention changes in wheelsets and clothing between the indoor and outdoor tests. And while they give a price/watts number for wheelset changes they don't mention actual watts savings for wheelset changes elsewhere...

But still an interesting read and probably a good first approximation of savings.

Monday, November 24, 2008

Winter Coping Strategies

One of the problems with cycling in Metro Vancouver (aka Lower Mainland) in the winter is that you get flats... Usually the problem is that wet glass cuts rubber far easier than when it is dry. And we are blessed with long, cold, wet Winters here.

So in a (possibly vain) attempt to reduce or minimize this problem I have evolved the following strategy:
  • start with a good set of training wheels
  • make sure that you have a good set of reasonably flat proof tires
  • put in some cheap, heavy tubes (weight is more rubber, more rubber, harder to puncture)
  • install with Tuffy Liners (those strips of thick plastic tape that go between your tube and tire, again to prevent puntures)
  • fill the tubes with puncture sealant (note for above, when buying the tubes make sure you get ones that have removable presta valve)
So to actually get a flat, something has to get through the new puncture resistant tire, through the tuffy liner, through the thick rubber tube, and then leave a hole to big for the sealant to fix.

The only downsize is that your wheels feel like they came off a Wal-Mart Huffy... These are not wheels for riding in a race or HC.

Finally for on the road, just in case:
  • working pump
  • CO2 inflator
  • replacement tube
  • emergency flat patches
  • presta adapter to allow filling at a gas station
  • cell phone to call home
I really hate having to use the cell phone to call home.. It usually results in months of reminders about too much cycling etc etc. :-)

The other Winter safety strategy is lights, lots of lites, even more lights... I have four different blinky lights on the rear of the bike (and helmet). Plus two small blinkies and one big (2 watt) LED spot on the front... I especially like the new blinky lites that have 5 or 6 LED's and flash in a "circle" effect..  

Finally I dropped by my LBS (Capps Westwood) and asked for some of "those reflectors that come on all the new bikes wheels"...  The ones that NOBODY ever keeps on their bike... (well except for kids under 8 maybe...)  Anyway, they obliged out of a huge box of them (actually they had to look a bit to get some that work on flat racing spokes, they where quite amused by the entire project...) 

The point is that these actually provide some nice protection from the side where the blinky lights are not usually that well seen. Better safe than in fashion.

Anyway if you see someone in the Port Moody area, dressed in Red EV kit, light up like an Xmas tree, riding a bike with almost balloon tires... it's probably just me...

Sunday, November 23, 2008

Anmore Tour - L3/L4

Base, base and more base.... to compliment the intensity I'm getting at the track.

Today was Anomore Tour - slow due to the cold weather. But trying to maintain L4 up the hills at least (well at least for the first hour...)

Yesterday was Westwood L3 HC... 

Friday, November 21, 2008

BVC Friday Night - Kierins zip, Scratch 1st

Kierins and a 20 Lap Scratch...

Thought a smaller gear, 51x15 might be appropriate for the Kierin... it wasn't.. spun out chasing Anselmo and Scott around the last half lap... Cadence about 139, speed just over 60. Scott about 4 bike lengths ahead, Anselmo at least that much and a bit more in front of Scott ( think I was just rounding turn four when Anselmo was crossing the finish line). Note to self, leave the 51x14 on next time...

Made up for it in the 20 lap scratch race. Normally I don't do well in a short scratch... I stayed at or near the front from the beginning. first on the rail, first aound for the neutral lap, instead of moving to back, just drop back a few riders and get a shoulder draft just above the red. When possible find a hole and drop in.

Fast paced... except for one slightly slower lap. Average speed for 15 laps about 48km/h. Anthony King then jumped with about 4.5 to go and I managed to get onto his wheel. Followed him around until the bell rang. Went over to easily get 1st.

Finished the night trying out the 52x14. Still feels sluggish. Up to a point as I move the size up I can spin lower to push out whatever watts are required for a specific speed. But too high and I can't quite get on top of it and get to an appropriate speed. Instead of spinning too high, spinning too low. It felt better tonight than the last time I tried (about a month ago). Might be interesting to try in a Friday night race. Especially if I can get a bit more strength into my legs. 

Caffein enhances recovery..

Another caffeine study reported in Velonews... to add to the many reasons to indulge in our favourite (we hope) performance enhancing drug...

They report on a study that used (large) doses of caffeine after hard and long exercise sessions in trained athletes.
Blood glucose and blood insulin levels were also higher with the caffeine and carbohydrate test dose, and glucose transport into the muscle may also have been enhanced with the caffeine. “There was a more available pool of glucose and the caffeine may have tricked the glucose into entering the cell,” said Hawley. “Essentially it put more gas or petrol back in the engine.”
As Velonews points out though, the dosage used (560mg) is a tad higher than your normal Lattee or Coke product... It remains to be seen if smaller doses work as well.

I still say this is good news to us coffee adicts who complement our exercise (and non exercise) sessions with a capuccino.

Sunday, November 16, 2008

BVC Bare Bones - Sunday - 50 Lap Scratch

50 Lap Scratch Race

The leading omnium racers sprint for podium position in the final scratch race of the Omnium.

A fairly sedate 44km/h race for the first 40 laps... With the occasional bump up ... Stayed at the back for almost the entire race. Only 11-12 riders.

With about 10 laps to go I moved towards the front and high on the blue looking for Steph Roorda and David Gerth. 

I could do no worse then 2nd overall in the Ominium. David could take 1st if he beat me by more than a couple of places and Steph could move into 2nd if she took 1st and David finished well down.

With about 6-7 to go we where all lined up, Steph, David and myself... With about 5 to go Alex Pope lead us all out getting us very quickly from 45km/h to about 54km/h... With about 2 to go Steph lead us over Alex getting our speed up to 60km/h. David and I followed her around and managed to get over her for the final sprint. 

Finishing David Gerth 1st, myself 2nd and Steph Roorda 3rd. Gerth had almost a bike length, I had at best inches over Roorda.

BVC Bare Bones - Sunday - 6x10 Points

6x10 Points Race

Took the 2nd sprint. After the third sprint had a very minor close call on the blue, rubbed shoulders. I moved up and back-pedalled. That caused my chain to pop off..

Coasted down while Jeremie instructed all the other rides to neutralize and go high up to the blue line. With some help from Bruce Denis, got stopped in the pit zone. Put the chain back on and got back in with about 1-2 laps to spare.

Took the last sprint with a nice jump over the top. NIck Smit had taken enough points to get 1st. I got 2nd overall.

First half of the face had a reasonable pace, about 46.5km/h. The group was a little slower after the mechanical and never quite got their momentum back, averaging about 44km/h.

BVC Bare Bones - Saturday - 40 Lap Tempo

40 Lap Tempo Race

Worked at the back of the group for the first 16 or so laps. Then worked to get one, almost had a second but someone (I think Nick Smit) got me at the line.

I jumped at about lap 25. Steph managed to get on my wheel. So we traded sprints for about 5 or 6 laps before we got caught.

Waited until the end, mini-jump, took the second last lap and managed to carry through and take the last as well (which had been the plan.. double points.)

Good enough to get me 1st (with I think about 16-18 points) as the rest of the points where apparently well spread out (40 laps, 2 points for 1st, 1 for 2nd for each lap, double for the last lap, so a total of 123 points available...)

Average speed was 47.9kph. My average power 294 watts, NP average a bit higher at 313. The big jump in the middle was +800 with speed a little over 56kph.

BVC Bare Bones - Friday - Elimination to 10 lap scratch

Elimination to 10 lap Scratch Race

Sixteen starters, eliminating down to eight riders.

I managed to jump to the front and maintain a good solid +45kph pace for about 10 laps.. Michael Walker jumped over me at that point to lead for a few laps.. Then Alex Pope jumped over both of us (both where escaping the scrum at the back...) I followed Alex to the end of the eliminations (2 more I think).

I then sat at the back sucking wheels and getting my heart rate down for a few laps. Then moved up to the blue (reasonably easy going with only eight people on the track.)

Steph Roorda jumped over me from way up by the rail with 3.5 laps go to... Good gap, 40m... I bridged up to her (I don't think anyone else did, there didn't seem to be anyone behind me) with about 1 lap to go... Followed her to finish... But simply could not quite get past her.  She took it with about 1-2 inches...

The final sprint was 3.5 laps. 44 seconds. Hit +60 and +800 watts. Trailing down to about 55kph and 440 watts at the finish. 

BVC Bare Bones - Friday - 40 lap Scratch

40 Lap Scratch Race

Sucked wheels at the back for about 30 laps. Moved up and over to get positioned towards the front.

Anthony King jumped over me with 3 and half to go (he had apparantly come from way back, and had already been going hard for 2 laps at that point). 

Got his wheel....

Stewart Bowner managed to bridge up to us, went over, with about 1 lap to go... Followed him to finish and took him at the line (he was getting tired from bridging over.)

A fairly fast pace too, 45.8kph until the final sprint and then 53.4kph for the last 3.5 laps...

BVC Bare Bones - Podium

Thanks to Alex Pope... managed to get a podium shot for me to post...

Final results here and the Google Docs Spreadsheet with full results is here.

BVC Bare Bones - Friday - 5x10 Points

5x10 Points Race

Sucked wheels at the back for 25 laps... someone got off the front, bridged,  got the sprint at the line.

Next, went over top with 2 to go for the 2nd last sprint. Big gap... easily got 1st for that sprint.

Sat up, hoping 2 (of 5) 1st's would be enough for 1st or 2nd overall... it was.

This is the jump over the top for the 2nd last sprint... On the home stretch with about 2.5 laps to the sprint finish. Nice numbers... You can see even see the 2m elevation drop (although there is a little latency while it registers the change.)

Initial VO2Max jump, six second burst with 2m drop, accelerate from 45 to 54kph, just under 100m. Power peaks at 843 watts.

Tuck into sprinters lane, fourteen seconds with power falling down to 690 watts, speed topping out 60kph, 220m covered. Carry through another 11 seconds, 170m to sprint line, power dropping to about 400w and speed to 53.. 

Total time about 30 seconds with average speed 55.  Assuming the rest of the group got their average speed up to 50, the time differential should have been about 4 seconds (and if I recall, that was about correct.) 

In this sprint I had to moderate my effort so that my heartrate didn't blow up totally...doesn't do any good to take a sprint, but then blow up so bad that the field laps you (down 20 points...)

It almost did, 191 for over ten seconds... But those where with at the end while coasting through the sprint finish... And I had enough time to get it down just enough to tag on ...  

It's helpful to run the numbers on these  (preferrably in practice sessions so you know them.) I can do this from 2.5 laps out (~500m)... but at my present form, if I tried from say 3.5 laps out, my average speed would drop back down to 51kph and the extra time would allow the chasing group to get their speed UP to 51kph... I.e. catch me at the line or before it.

My two weaknesses in exploiting this tactic are not being comfortable getting out of the saddle; in theory (and in practice) if my bike handling skills where better, I would be able to get up and off the saddle and push some higher watts. And second, weak anaerobic system, it would be nice to have another 4-5 seconds at max output and another 10 seconds as I average down... Either would get me another lap before getting caught. Both would get me more.

And finally, it does require some co-operation from the rest of the group... By preference I look for a late sprint, something after 30-40 laps, where the group is getting tired, and hangs back a bit going into the 3-4 lap before the sprint. Then try and move up and get into position just at the right time to go over.. Of course it doesn't always work, if someone at the front lifts the pace it may not be possible to get over or if you do they may be able to stay on your wheel.

BVC Bare Bones - Sunday summary

Three races, down to the wire. 

With the top three B Omnium riders sprinting for 1st, 2nd and 3rd overall... in the last sprint of the last race..

Sundays races:
  1. Unknown Distance - 8th
  2. 6x10 Points - 2nd
  3. 50 Lap Scratch - 2nd
Final result:
  1. Stuart Lynne 107
  2. David Gerth 106
  3. Steph Roorda 93
  4. Nick Smit 70
Full results are here.

Steph Roorda pushed us hard every day, with great tactics, and always giving a shout to let me know to drop in..

David Gerth was amazingly consistent, placing mostly in the top four (except for two races today) and with a 1st in the last race today. This was his first B group race series, he was doing the C group until last Friday...

If we had another day of racing Nick Smit probably would have caught us... he got better every day and managed to take a lap (and the win) in Saturdays 60 lap scratch race and two 1sts today... very (very!) good endurance.

I had one mechanical today, a slight shoulder bump in the 6x10 Points race, moved up with a bit to much back pressure, popped the chain... Luckily no problems getting off the track and was able to get back in (you have 10 laps to get back in without penalty for a mechanical). But even though the heart rate was down, the adrenalin was running and it took me about 10 laps to get my rythm back.

Details to follow

Saturday, November 15, 2008

BVC Bare Bones - Saturday - 5x10 Points

5x10 Points Race

Took the first, fourth and last sprints for 1st overall.

Overall average speed was down a bit, just over 45km/h.  The speed during the middle section was higher, but there where 2+ laps  after the 2nd last sprint where the group took a bit of a rest at about 39km/h. 

BVC Bare Bones - Saturday Summary

Long day... long races
  1. 3x15 Points - didn't place
  2. 40 Lap Tempo - 1st
  3. 60 Lap Scratch - 9th
  4. Elimination - 5th
  5. 10x5 Points -1st
See saw battle all day between Steph Roorda and Dave Gerth for first in the Omnium... the spread was only 5 points all day with Steph taking the lead early on, then Dave catching up in the Tempo and Scratch and Elimination... But I managed to vault back up into first with the final Points race.. Ending up with:
  • Stuart Lynne 80
  • Dave Gerth 73
  • Steph Roorda 71
Three more races tomorrow morning... it could be any of us to win overall.  It will probably go down to the last race. 

I'll post race details later... off to bed now, up at 7:00 

Friday, November 14, 2008

BVC Bare Bones 3-day - First night....

Three races, B-Group, 1st, 1st and 2nd by an inch...

Leading the Omnium by 1 point (58 to Steph Roorda's 57).

I'll post individual race overviews later (have to get up and do be back at the track in ten hours, no time to cut and paste to get the jpgs) , but overall:
  1. 5x10 Points,  took 3rd and 4th sprint
  2. 40 lap Scratch, followed Anthony King's, then over top of Steward Bowmer wheel to win...
  3. Elimination to 10 lap scratch, Steph Roorda beat me to the line...

Other than a two hour L2/L3 Computrainer workout on Tuesday, and some of the Power Meter Ramp tests, I took most of the week off ...  a bit of a mini-taper going into this weekend. Which gave me about a 15 TSB... Which certainly helped. Both of the wins and the almost win where at the far end of RPE for the sprints... 

The power numbers (and ATL, CTL, TSS etc above) are with the new and "improved" re-calibrated track Ergomo... Moved up in the end from 181 to 186. Which makes it match the CT reasonably well in the 175-350 watt range... Interesting to see how lowering FTP and re-calibrating the track Ergomo starts giving me much higher TSS points for the Intensity you see in track racing.

Monday, November 10, 2008

Method for Calibrating Ergomo Power Meter using Computrainer

This describes how to calibrate an Ergomo Power Meter using a Lab Computrainer.

It is hard to verify that the Computrainer is more or less accurate than any particular Ergomo. But using a simple ramp test we can confirm two things. First how the two devices diverge. And second get a reasonable idea on how reproducible the two report.

Finally, if you have more than one Power Meter for different bikes, then using this method, you can re-calibrate them so that they agree. And that they agree with your trainer (assuming you are using a CT for your trainer.) 

I have three different Ergomo BB's (road, TT and track) and train indoors on the CT. Prior to developing this procedure I was getting fairly divergent numbers. Large enough to make a difference to CTL/ATL/TSB numbers in WKO+. Getting them all to agree was the reason for doing this.

1. Setup

Setup is simple. You just need to get your bike with PM installed and setup on the Computrainer. 

Tire pressure should be about 110PSI. 

The roller on the CT should be cleaned.

Do the initial re-calibrate for the CT. Typically I try for about 3.00 at this point. Adjust the roller appropriately.

2. Warm up

Do a simple warmup. About 100-200 watts. Do a re-calibrate every 3-4 minutes. If the number falls below 2.5, increase the roller clamp pressure.

Once you have a stable number over 2.5, seen in two or more re-calibrations a couple of minutes apart proceed to step 3.

3. Ramp Test

Start the coaching software, using the following erg file:

DESCRIPTION = Power Meter Calibration 60w per min
FILE NAME = PowerMeterCalibration20.erg
0.0     100
8.0    580
This is a simple ramp test, starting at 100W and increasing 60W every minute. 

4. Test

To ensure that the CT didn't cool down, do another few minutes of warmup with the coaching software running, the test loaded, but not started.

Then start the test, ensure that your Power Meter is also recording.

Try to maintain a fairly constant and comfortable cadence. If possible over 80RPM. 

The first few minutes are easy... the last minute is hell... hang in as long as you can.

5. Results

Copy the CDF.txt file produced from the Coaching file into WKO+. Also import your PM data.

Inspect both files and cut out the parts that do not pertain to the test. You should end up with about 4-6 minutes of data from both the CT and your PM.

Use the Export facility to save these into a CSV file.

6. Excel

Open the two CSV files in Excel, and also create a new empty workbook. Cut and paste the Minutes and Watts columns from the CT and PM CSV files into the workbook. You can use Excel tools to compare your results.

7. Sample one - Soloist Ergomo with K-factor 184

This is from a Soloist with Ergomo BB and the factory K-Factor setting.

The two time series are plotted as an X/Y scatter plot (as lines) with trendlines added. Finally a difference column was added and plotted.  

This shows that there is a substantial difference, with the Ergomo reading much higher. The difference does not quite scale linearly. It increases slightly as can be seen in the Diff plot (which uses the right axis).

8. Sample two- Soloist Ergomo with K-factor 164

This test is for the same bike with the K-factor adjusted down from 184 to 164. 

Note that while not an exact match, it is reasonably close now.  

The Diff line is still not exactly linear and does show that the Ergomo is more variable (again Diff is show using right axis.)

9. Conclusions

As can be seen, it is reasonably easy to get the Ergomo to match the Computrainer by adjusting the K-Factor appropriately. 

While this does not guarantee accuracy, it does provide a way to ensure that multiple devices are all setup to produce similiar results.

The (presumably) best results for this procedure would be with a reasonably new Lab Computrainer. But it is possible that acceptable results could be obtained with the non Lab version or possibly a Tacx or other trainer that can control the watts in "Erg" mode (i.e. set the load level absolutely, regardless of tire speed, rider cadence etc.) and can record the results.

Sunday, November 9, 2008

New FTP!

Good news bad news...

After doing a VO2Max test a few weeks back I decided that my Ergomo's where reading too high. At least WRT to the Computrainer at the Lab.. So I repeated the ramp test here on my Computrainer, using my P2c with Ergomo. And then compared the results... 

It showed that P2C Ergomo was reading perhaps 20% to high in the "interesting" range (200-350). 

So I replicated the test using the Soloist with it's Ergomo. Similiar, although possibly not quite 20%. 

So off to the track and drag home the track bike and test with it... There the numbers matched reasonably well, although possibly slightly low.

So mea culpa... I now have a good explanation of why the numbers on the TT bike where slightly higher than the road bike. And why both the those where higher than the CT or Track... 

I had assumed, since the number from the two road bikes (Soloist and P2c) where reasonably similiar, that they where fairly trust worthy.. Apparantly a bad assumption.

I'll do a separate post showing some sample results and explaining the test regime. The results are that I have reset the K-Factor's on each of the Ergomo's to adjust them down (or up) as appropriate:

  1. Track 181 -> 182
  2. Soloist 184 -> 165
  3. P2C 196 -> 164
This assumes of course that the Lab Computrainer I have is accurate. Not necessarily a great assumption. But the main excercise is not so much absolute accuracy as having the all of the devices I use provide equivalant data. I'll also point out that a) it is a Lab CT, b) it's reasonably new and lightly used (<2years)>

The above adjustments should mean an FTP in the new regime of about 280. I"ll need to do some testing to confirm that one way or another.

The other problem is that CTL/ATL/TSB for the last few months (since I've been back at the track) are off significantly. If the track bike was under reporting as compared to the FTP from testing on the road, then TSS points computed and therefore CTL/ATL/TSB are too low. Especically true on the track where we see short and intense efforts. 

Going forward we'll be ok. But it takes some work to get the past few months corrected. The simplest approach is to simply use the "new zones" feature to set a new FTP prior to each weeks track or road. Moving it up and down to match. The end result was to move current CTL from about 70 to 79.

Today was the first day out on the re-calibrated Soloist... Got rained on doing Ford Road at L2/L3. The legs where a bit tired from doing the (5) ramp tests yestered (start at 100 and ramp at 60w/minute until failure, about 5 minutes...) 

Friday, November 7, 2008

BVC Friday Racing - 1st, 3rd

Strong fields in all three catagories tonight. We had 16 starters in the B group.

First race was a 25 Lap Tempo (1 point per lap for first across the line.) Too short for me, by the time I worked up to the front the front had moved off a half lap. I tried with 4 laps to go to bridge, but it was a bridge too far... Fast pace, I finished a half lap back and had average speed of 47.7 km/h.

Second race was a 4x7 Progressive. Points race but where points are 1 for first sprint; 2, 1 for the secone, 3,2,1 for the third, 5,3,2,1 for the fourth etc.. I managed to work to the front, the front was still there... and got a fantastic position, just back and up from the front with 3-4 laps to go. The front runners had slowed down a bit and no one was interested in jumping at 3 laps. With two laps to go I had moved up over the blue and went over the top. Got a big gap(!!) jumping over with the big gear coming down from the blue. With 1 lap to go I looked back and there was no one in sight on the home stretch. So I feathered and just rode around to finish. That got me a 1st overall as well. Another fast paced race, 47.6 km/h.

Last was a 30 lap Snowball. I managed to get two laps about lap 17... sThen there was a crash so the race was halted for about five minutes. Getting started again was tough. All the young guys where fresh again and just sprinted for the last 13 laps... I did manage to get one more,  should have been two but someone nipped me at the line. Anyway, was still enough to get me a 3rd.

Saturday, November 1, 2008

Westwood - HC L3

More L3 hill climbing....  just under 1400m in two and a half hours... Slow and easy, build base. 

Wet day... kept trying to rain on me... Fortunately not to cold (12C) so getting wet wasn't too bad. I did end up with the rain cape on to stay wam on the descents.